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Does Free Speech Have Limits?
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| abanks47 |
Date: Wednesday, 24/Nov/10, 8:08 PM | Message # 1 |
Emcees
Posts: 1466
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in light of a recent thread (JMT in Amserterdam) I was curious what some of you thought on freedom of speech? How far can/should one go? Just because you have the freedom to say what you like should you? There's obviously millions of variables as to when you should shut the fucfk up but just curious what some of yall think about freedom of speech. an interesting video where frank zappa speaks his mind on censorship around the time hip hop was catching peoples eyes
A WELL DRESSED SKELETON SLOWLY CUTS YOUR THROAT. "I Have No Fear Whatsoever of Anybody or Anything" -Malcolm X “those who consider themselves the most adamant adherents of “real” hip-hop can also be the least knowledgeable.” –Adilifu Nama; an excert from his perception of Nas’s “Genesis”
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| EmSeeD |
Date: Wednesday, 24/Nov/10, 8:41 PM | Message # 2 |
Heads
Posts: 11464
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yeah i was thinking about this too, this is gonna take a lot of thought so i'm gonna need some time with this one lol but as of now i don't think freedom of speech should have limits because if you can have people limiting what others say then its a way of controlling and enslaving people, and then theres the issue of who exactly decides what you're allowed to say etc. should hate speech be allowed? people should have the right to say hate speech if they're a hateful person but it if their hate speech is deemed wrong then it shouldn't be supported, they should have the right to say it but then others have the right to disagree and there are bad consequences for hate speech. but as of now i don't think freedom of have limits
http://chirbit.com/emseed
http://youtube.com/siwooot
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| Menace |
Date: Wednesday, 24/Nov/10, 9:30 PM | Message # 3 |
Heads
Posts: 6764
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the burden of proof is on the those that use hate speech , as hate speech users have the right to freedom of expression and such those attacked by hate speech users have the right to protest those who attacked them to sue them etc. Its so one dimensional in some peoples heads, yes freedom of speech is an unalienable right but when you get a reply from those people you attacked then don't go screaming freedom of speech is violated , the people you attacked have the same rights as you and can challenge you, that's how a functioning democracy works when you use hate speech the burden of proof is upon you when you are attacked by those that you attacked in the first place then don't go crying freedom of speech you brought it on yourself plus once and for all FREEDOM OF SPEECH is not a one side coin those people at COC  used their rights to freedom of expression against JMT they did nothing wrong they did what JMT did in the first place. Also i don't condone state censorship nobody should censor nobody.
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| Treach |
Date: Thursday, 25/Nov/10, 4:17 AM | Message # 4 |
OGs
Posts: 1339
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^ agreed
"We took pride in intellect and skill
Now you gotta have some sex appeal to get a record deal"
- K-RINO
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| abanks47 |
Date: Thursday, 25/Nov/10, 11:49 AM | Message # 5 |
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Emcees
Posts: 1466
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i understand that they had the right to be upset with JMT but it just seems odd and trivial to go after a song. as an artist i would imagine jmt not changing there lyrics for anyone and on top of that that seems to be just a taste of there'offensive speech' the rest of there lyrics are offensive to multiple demographics and i dont understand why they'd only focus on homophobic speech and not woman, Christian, Islamic ect. i do agree as well does UK/Europe have the same freedom of speech laws as the US? are they more relaxed or more strict or does it vary from country to country
A WELL DRESSED SKELETON SLOWLY CUTS YOUR THROAT. "I Have No Fear Whatsoever of Anybody or Anything" -Malcolm X “those who consider themselves the most adamant adherents of “real” hip-hop can also be the least knowledgeable.” –Adilifu Nama; an excert from his perception of Nas’s “Genesis”
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| Menace |
Date: Thursday, 25/Nov/10, 5:23 PM | Message # 6 |
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Heads
Posts: 6764
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Quote (abanks47) does UK/Europe have the same freedom of speech laws as the US? are they more relaxed or more strict or does it vary from country to country EU member countries adhere to the "Charter of Fundamental Rights of the European Union", the rest i personally don't know, but from what i know and i saw its virtually the same, the only thing different is that capital punishment is prohibited . But such reactions come because in the old EU member states there is a "liberal"tendecy within the population regarding gay people and such.
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| eboyd |
Date: Thursday, 25/Nov/10, 11:43 PM | Message # 7 |
Heads
Posts: 13145
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abanks, after watching that video you posted Frank Zappa is my new idol lol! i pretty much agree word for word with what Menace said however... what if free speech is directly responsible for someone being injured or killed. yes, i am talking about the yelling fire in a crowded theatre example. is that ok? say i yell "FIRE!!!" in a crowded theatre knowing there is no fire and some little baby gets trampled to death. is my speech not responsible for this tragedy? other than this example i feel freedom of speech should have no exceptions.
my new theme song
erikboyd60@hotmail.com
"True poetry can communicate before it is understood"
-T.S. Eliot
battle record:
7-0-0
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| abanks47 |
Date: Friday, 26/Nov/10, 1:45 AM | Message # 8 |
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Emcees
Posts: 1466
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what about a song that incites riots and/or murder and someone actually does it? i know this is a bullshit defense for a lot of people so for the sake of argument there is evidence that this so called song influenced an individual to commit a murder
A WELL DRESSED SKELETON SLOWLY CUTS YOUR THROAT. "I Have No Fear Whatsoever of Anybody or Anything" -Malcolm X “those who consider themselves the most adamant adherents of “real” hip-hop can also be the least knowledgeable.” –Adilifu Nama; an excert from his perception of Nas’s “Genesis”
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| abanks47 |
Date: Friday, 26/Nov/10, 1:49 AM | Message # 9 |
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Emcees
Posts: 1466
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host: there are certain words you use to describe an act of fornication which is just brutal? zappa: so? i loved that the first time watching that
A WELL DRESSED SKELETON SLOWLY CUTS YOUR THROAT. "I Have No Fear Whatsoever of Anybody or Anything" -Malcolm X “those who consider themselves the most adamant adherents of “real” hip-hop can also be the least knowledgeable.” –Adilifu Nama; an excert from his perception of Nas’s “Genesis”
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| eboyd |
Date: Friday, 26/Nov/10, 2:03 AM | Message # 10 |
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Heads
Posts: 13145
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Quote (abanks47) what about a song that incites riots and/or murder and someone actually does it? i know this is a bullshit defense for a lot of people so for the sake of argument there is evidence that this so called song influenced an individual to commit a murder that is a far cry from my example because with saying "FIRE!" in a crowded theatre you are actually frightening someone into an act that may lead to harm. technically you are using force because you saying that forced people who believed you to panic. it's like the unarmed bandit who says he has a gun and is going to kill you if you don't do something for him. with music, there are no songs that can actually strike so much fear into someone as to incite a harmful act forcibly. if there is a song like that, show me, because i've never heard one. Quote (abanks47) host: there are certain words you use to describe an act of fornication which is just brutal? zappa: so? i loved that the first time watching that lol yeah, he was brilliant! it was awesome
my new theme song
erikboyd60@hotmail.com
"True poetry can communicate before it is understood"
-T.S. Eliot
battle record:
7-0-0
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| Menace |
Date: Friday, 26/Nov/10, 6:25 PM | Message # 11 |
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Heads
Posts: 6764
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Quote (eboyd) what if free speech is directly responsible for someone being injured or killed. yes, i am talking about the yelling fire in a crowded theatre example. is that ok? say i yell "FIRE!!!" in a crowded theatre knowing there is no fire and some little baby gets trampled to death. is my speech not responsible for this tragedy? anyone doing that shouldn't be out in the first place LOL Quote (abanks47) what about a song that incites riots and/or murder and someone actually does it? i know this is a bullshit defense for a lot of people so for the sake of argument there is evidence that this so called song influenced an individual to commit a murder
Even if such a thing can be , what sane person can do that ? both of your examples are things sane people wouldn't do , even children wouldn't do that
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| eboyd |
Date: Tuesday, 07/Dec/10, 4:16 AM | Message # 12 |
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Heads
Posts: 13145
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Quote (Menace) anyone doing that shouldn't be out in the first place LOL LMAO! but if you limit him from "being out" you still limit his freedom 
my new theme song
erikboyd60@hotmail.com
"True poetry can communicate before it is understood"
-T.S. Eliot
battle record:
7-0-0
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| s0dr2 |
Date: Tuesday, 07/Dec/10, 12:41 PM | Message # 13 |
OGs
Posts: 2772
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Quote (eboyd) what if free speech is directly responsible for someone being injured or killed. yes, i am talking about the yelling fire in a crowded theatre example. is that ok? say i yell "FIRE!!!" in a crowded theatre knowing there is no fire and some little baby gets trampled to death. is my speech not responsible for this tragedy?
i wouldnt consider that speech, thats more of an action if that makes sense... you would blame the guy telling him "why would you DO that" feel me dawg? its not like he's stating opinions or something man i have like 10 zappa albums i cant get into
"Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbour. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover." - Mark Twain
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| eboyd |
Date: Wednesday, 08/Dec/10, 3:08 AM | Message # 14 |
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Heads
Posts: 13145
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Quote (s0dr2) i wouldnt consider that speech, thats more of an action if that makes sense... you would blame the guy telling him "why would you DO that" feel me dawg? its not like he's stating opinions or something that's actually a REALLY good point! i never thought of it that way... reps! 
my new theme song
erikboyd60@hotmail.com
"True poetry can communicate before it is understood"
-T.S. Eliot
battle record:
7-0-0
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